Dr. Raúl Necochea
Department of Social Medicine
UNC School of Medicine
Faculty Profile
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Interview Transcript
Dr. Necochea: Very well. Today is Monday, October 17th. This is Dr. Raul Necochea from the UNC School of Medicine, and I am interviewing Dr. Jon Regis, UNC School of Medicine, Class of 1978. Good afternoon, Dr. Regis.
Dr. Regis: Good afternoon. How are you?
Dr. Necochea: I’m well. Thank you very much. How are you?
Dr. Regis: I’m doing fine. You know. Just hanging in there and trying to still make things happen in healthcare.
Dr. Necochea: Thank you very much for talking to us about the Black Alumni Experience Project at the UNC School of Medicine. We are very glad to have you with us.
Dr. Regis: Sure. Thank you so much. Thank you.
Dr. Necochea: To begin this interview, would you please first tell us about your place and date of birth?
Dr. Regis: Uh… I was born in – I’m an Army brat. My dad was a 30-year Army uh – uh – veteran. I was actually born in Fort Bragg, North Carolina, and grew up in Fayetteville, North Carolina. And my father served in World War II, Korea, and Vietnam.
Dr. Necochea: Whoa.
Dr. Regis: Grew up in an environment that was – He was a – he was a real patriot, instead of somebody trying to overtake or overrun the Capitol on January 6th, but I’ll leave – uh – I’ll leave that alone. But grew up in that kind of environment where just about everybody that I grew up with, fathers were in either the Army or mothers taught school. It was a very unique environment where I grew up in Fayetteville, North Carolina.
Dr. Necochea: Mm-hmm. Can you tell us a little bit about what your family was like? What it was like growing up with them?
Dr. Regis: Well, it’s interesting because we – for that time, I would say, we were a very middle class, if not somewhat – I wouldn’t say upper middle class, but we – we – we did well. My father was a Sergeant – a First Sergeant in the Army, which is probably the highest noncommissioned rank in the Army. My mother was a schoolteacher, um – went to school at Fayetteville State and actually got her Master’s from North Carolina Central University in Durham.
Dr. Necochea: Mm-hmm.
Dr. Regis: I’m the youngest of four. My two older sisters, who are advanced degree, they were also schoolteachers and guidance counselors, and my brother uh went to Virginia State and was a Lieutenant in the uh – a Captain in the Army for a while before he went out into business. So, it was a very – we grew up in a very educated family.
Dr. Necochea: Mm-hmm.
Dr. Regis: All of the people and friends in my neighborhood, our mothers were schoolteachers. So, it was a unique environment and plus, you’ve got to understand, by the time I joined, the Armed Services had been desegregated.
Dr. Necochea: Mm-hmm.
Dr. Regis: We didn’t have this strict, rigid, uh – Jim Crow – uh – in Fayetteville, North Carolina because the Army made sure that – In fact, let me tell you one of the most untold stories of the civil rights movement is that when some of the soldiers started coming back from World War II, which my dad was in, they – they actually uh – uh – took over busses because they refused to go to this Jim Crow stuff.
Dr. Necochea: Hmm.
Dr. Regis: And so, it caused a lot of fury, as you can imagine. Well, the General at that time of the whole base came down and told the White community – business community, that if you don’t serve my Black soldiers, I’m not going to have any soldiers come down here. And that opened up things the next day. [Both laughing]. Money talks.
Dr. Necochea: Yes. Hit them in the pocket.
Dr. Regis: That happened before I was born. But… So I grew up – I grew up in a very unique, southern environment. Very.
Dr. Necochea: Yeah. The Army – the military life, kind of – uh – it provides that environment.
Dr. Regis: Yeah. Well, the other thing is, I also was – My father’s from Louisiana. We’re actually Creole, so that and – and most Creole’s are Catholic. So, I grew up a Black Catholic in Fayetteville, which was integrated at the time. So, I’ve never actually been in an all-Black environment in terms of schooling, ever.
Dr. Necochea: Huh.
Dr. Regis:I been to Catholic school and then the Catholic school with the high school, which at that time were integrated. So again, I think my experience, not that it was better than anybody, but it was – it was different than most folks in my age group that grew up in the South at that time.
Dr. Necochea: Right. They would have grown up going to schools that were segregated de facto.
Dr. Regis:Yeah. Yeah. A lot of them, yes.
Dr. Necochea: And they would have gone through the experience of transitioning into, you know, integrated environments.
Dr. Regis: Yeah. It – it – it was… One of the interesting things is I went to Reid Ross Senior High, which is now a junior high, and it was a brand-new school when we went there, so it had that tradition of segregation and old boy network. It was a brand-new high school, so everybody came there knew that. And it – it was just a unique environment that I grew up in.
Dr. Necochea: I forgot to ask you, what year were you born?
Dr. Regis: 1951.
Dr. Necochea: Got it.
Dr. Regis: December 22, 1951.
Dr. Necochea: When you were young, who was the most influential, or who were the most influential people in your youth? You know –
Dr. Regis: Easy.
Dr. Necochea: Relatives or friends? Church?
Dr. Regis: Easy. The most influential person in my life, that actually uh – outside of my mom and dad and some relatives, was the local Black physician, Dr. Herbert Vick.
Dr. Necochea:Can you spell that, please, for me?
Dr. Regis: Herbert Vick. V-I-C-K.Dr. Necochea:Thank you.
Dr. Regis: He was well known at that time. One of the first Black physician at – attending at a local hospital in Fayetteville, and his daughter was a great friend of mine. We went to Catholic School together. In fact, she’s – I just talked with her tonight. She’s one of my oldest friends in the world. But her dad was a major, major influence on me, and a major influence on me going to med school.
Dr. Necochea: I was going to ask you if you knew some docs when you were growing up.
Dr. Regis: I can remember riding with him, with her – and her name was Lynn – as he would go make rounds at the VA Hospital in Fayetteville back in 1960 – no, this may have been ’57, ’58. To see a Black doc go into a hospital and get that kind of respect and – and – and go into his office that he had in the hospital, and that he had in the community, which was, again, quite unique.
Dr. Necochea: In school, did you go to school with other military kids?
Dr. Regis: Oh yeah. [Laughs]. I’m telling you, most of the kids I went to school with, in Catholic School and in high school – I would say 65% to 70% of them had either their parents, one of them in the military, or they had close relatives or brother or sister in the military. Fayetteville was a military – it used to be predominately a military town. Now its own – you know, you even got Fayetteville State, which is now a prestigious university system. Back when I was there, Fayetteville State was a historically Black university. It still is, but I would bet you in the next 20 years, Fayetteville State will not be known as a Black – as a historically Black college.
Dr. Necochea: Mm-hmm.
Dr. Regis:In fact, I don’t even think it’s known that way now.
Dr. Necochea: Nope.
Dr. Regis: But it used to. In fact, it used to be called Fayetteville State College Normal School for Colored’s, which its objective was to reach Black teachers to teach in Black schools.
Dr. Necochea: Mm-hmm.
Dr. Regis: My grandmother went there, and my mother.
Dr. Necochea: Wow.
Dr. Regis: So, trust me.
Dr. Necochea: Did you go to high school in Fayetteville as well?
Dr. Regis: Yeah. I went to Terry Sanford High School, which was one of the older uh high schools, my sophomore year, which was all White, back during the day when I was growing up. And then they integrated when the wave of integration came through in the late ‘60s. And then, they opened up a new high school in Fayetteville, and it drew people from all over Fayetteville that wanted to go to a new high school. And I wanted to.
Dr. Necochea: And growing up and in high school, did you – what did you enjoy doing the most in school?
Dr. Regis:Uh… Believe it or not, I enjoyed school. I enjoyed schoolwork. I played football.
Dr. Necochea: Uh-huh.Dr. Regis: Yeah. And and and uh… By the way, I was quite good at it, if I do say so myself. But, I mean. I participated in maybe one of the first integrated Key Clubs, which was a high school Kiwanis club, and I was very active in the community at that time.
Dr. Necochea: Huh. Had you already begun thinking, maybe medicine is something you’d like to pursue?
Dr. Regis: Yeah. In fact, I… Well my experience with Dr. Vick. I thought medical school took too long, so I was looking at medical technology, whatever that means.
Dr. Necochea:Uh-huh.
Dr. Regis: And then, quite frankly, I looked at what medical technologists were making at that time, and I said, “Yeah,, I might as well just go to medical school or try to get in, because what else am I going to be doing?” [Laughs].
Dr. Necochea: Right.
Dr. Regis:And I’ve always liked medicine because I had a close association with it, with my best friend’s father was one of the local, Black physicians in the town.
Dr. Necochea: Right. Yeah. Did you ever think about a career in the military?
Dr. Regis: Yes. In fact, one of my – um… How to put this? One of my um… greatest disappointments is that I’m one of the few males, or the only male in my immediate family uh that didn’t serve. Because to serve is an honor.
Dr. Necochea: Mm-hmm.
Dr. Regis: And when I went to medical school, they gave you deferments.
Dr. Necochea: Mm-hmm.
Dr. Regis: Uh… Because it was during the Vietnam War.
Dr. Necochea: Right.
Dr. Regis: And so, when they had the draft, they had the lottery.
Dr. Necochea: Mm-hmm.
Dr. Regis: Well, if you were going to medical school, you didn’t have to even deal with that, and because they wanted you in med school. And so, I never served, where my sisters’ husbands were officers, and my brother was an officer; um… cousin, aunts, and uncles, and to this day it – I could have gone into military medicine afterwards, but it just didn’t happen. But that’s one of my major, biggest life disappointments that I did not serve.
Dr. Necochea: Got it. As you were about to – you know – finish high school, you already were thinking that you were college-bound then?
Dr. Regis: Yeah. Another unique – another unique uh… item about how I grew up, which was very unusual at the time, I didn’t have any friends, but one that didn’t go to college.
Dr. Necochea: Who did not go to college?
Dr. Regis: Did not. Yeah. When I tell you, I grew up in a very educated, Black, middle-class… Moms taught schools. Dads were in the military. Uh – uh – I… My group of close friends, my little clique of circle of friends in high school, only one of them did not go to college. It was… Let me tell you, it wasn’t never not – it wasn’t even discussed in my family. You didn’t have an option. So, we grew up knowing that was the next step. There was no, “You’re not going to go to college.” But so that – that is very unique, if you can imagine.
Dr. Necochea: Yes. Yes, I can. It was a – You didn’t have to think about it. You are going to college, period.
Dr. Regis: By the way, if you take away the military, Dr. Mask and I grew up pretty much the same way. His parents were teachers and it’s very interesting.
Dr. Necochea: Mm-hmm. Yes, indeed. I’m getting this point from several of the folks I’ve interviewed, that the reality of middle-class life shapes young people’s – all sorts of opportunities for young people.
Dr. Regis: Yeah. And I think that – that it was unique back in North Carolina because you gotta say, North Carolina probably had the second highest number of historically Black colleges in the country. So, that milieu of education, especially in my hometown, Fayetteville State was a major influencer in the local community, Black and White.
Dr. Necochea: Mm-hmm.
Dr. Regis: And then when integration came about, it – it just furthered the impact of those who were already in the education system. So it was a very – let me tell you, it was a very unique time and a unique time I went to Carolina, was very unique. I entered in 1970 and uh Carolina had been – of course, it integrated way before then, but I think our class, in 1970, was the largest number of Black students they took in at one time. In fact, I understand it’s still one of the largest number of Black students, freshman, that came in at one time.
Dr. Necochea: Hmm. Yep. That’s correct. So, you started here at UNC in 1970 for undergraduate?
Dr. Regis:Yes.
Dr. Necochea: What was the process like to apply for UNC at the time?
Dr. Regis:UNC was my second choice or third choice.
Dr. Necochea: Uh-huh.
Dr. Regis: What got me to go to UNC was, I had had several White friends in high school, and another friend of mine, Black friend, they – they wanted to go visit UNC. So, I said, “Okay, man. I mean. I’ll go with you guys.” And we got into a car – mind you, this is 1970, down south. This integrated we would – we drove up to visit Chapel Hill and went to the old Rathskeller Restaurant. And then at that time, Carolina had hired their first Black administrator who – whose – one of his jobs was to recruit Black students. His name was Benny Renwick.
Dr. Necochea: Wait —
Dr. Regis: By the way, Benny Renwick is probably the most important Black, historical figure in the early ‘70s for Black students being at Carolina. Everybody knew him and he had touched their lives, and that’s how they got to Carolina.
Dr. Necochea: Can you spell his name again, please?
Dr. Regis: Renwick. R-E-N-W-I-C-K. By the way, at one while, before he retired, he was up to beat Provost. Now he’s since passed away, but Benny Renwick was well known uh among the students and among the uh – the academia in Carolina at that time. He was one of the first senior level, Black administrators.
Dr. Necochea: Huh. Did you meet him? Did you have a chance to meet him when you –
Dr. Regis: Oh absolutely. We partied together. [Both laughing]. I mean. He was not… he wasn’t that much older than we were, maybe five or six or seven years.
Dr. Necochea: Wow.
Dr. Regis: And so, when he started recruit us, and I saw this guy, I said, “Wow, it’s a young Black guy from Carolina –” I said so – That was part of the reason why I took the trip and ended up going actually going to Carolina. Yeah. I almost forgot that part of the story. And we would – he would have kids over. He would – he would come to some of our parties. I remember his wife very well.
Dr. Necochea: Wow.
Dr. Regis: I mean. Yeah.
Dr. Necochea: Can I ask you; how did you pay for your college education?
Dr. Regis: Back during those days, it was very easy. There was a lot of money around.
Dr. Necochea: Mm-hmm.
Dr. Regis:They had the National Student Defense loan program. They had other programs. During those days, they would give you so much money that if you paid your scholarship, you paid your – Of course, I had some minor scholarships. And they had grants. And if you went to Vance Hall, it used to be the student-aid office, and you paid all your fees, they would give you the remaining money that was left over to you.
Dr. Necochea: Oh, wow.
Dr. Regis: Oh, so you had kids walking around, after they paid on their school bills, with $2,000.00 or $3,000.00.
Dr. Necochea: Wow.Dr. Regis: Oh, we used to love it.
Dr. Necochea: That’s some actual cash in 1970.
Dr. Regis: Yeah. It was – it was – it was major. And – and – and they were trying to get more Black students involved so the additional dollars, but everybody had – was a – made it. That’s when they had the whole grant program, no payback money. Uh… They had the National Student Defense loan money, which was – Plus, to go to Carolina at that time was probably – I think I paid $400.00 or $500.00 a semester for tuition.
Dr. Necochea: Wow.
Dr. Regis: I don’t know the exact number, but it ain’t – it’s nothing like what it is now.
Dr. Necochea: Yeah. No, definitely. The affordability gap is just – Yeah, it’s more than a gap now.
Dr. Regis: Plus, if you were from North Carolina, Chapel Hill was like – I don’t think it was more than $400.00 a semester for tuition.
Dr. Necochea: Wow. When you started, were you, you know, kind of open to whatever college life might offer you or were you already thinking, you know, “I’m going to medicine. That’s me.”?Dr. Regis: No. I wanted to go to medicine – medical school, but I was open – In fact, at one while, I actually changed my mind and was looking more into law. I – um – I got to college and – and met a – and by the way, it’s very interesting, most of the other Black students, the majority that I knew, had similar background that I had. It’s very interesting.
Dr. Necochea Huh.
Dr. Regis: They came from solidly – from from from a South – some of them came from solidly, middle-class families. Our mothers and fathers were either doctors or schoolteachers or business owners. Carolina got a select group of Black students to uh to uh to matriculate during that time period. And most of them came from educated backgrounds. In fact, the majority of them came – the education – the family came from, it was more intense or more educated than the White students.
Dr. Necochea: Huh.
Dr. Regis: Oh yeah.
Dr. Necochea: Right. I mean… You can read that also in –
Dr. Regis: They selected —
Dr. Necochea: Yeah.
Dr. Regis: — Black students they knew would have a high success rate. Um… So, they wouldn’t have a problem – students who didn’t complete – and that might be a hindrance —
Dr. Necochea: Mm hmm.
Dr. Regis: To a decrease in the number of Black students, because a number of – not many of them graduating.
Dr. Necochea: At the time, do you remember what was the – what was the reputation of UNC undergraduates?
Dr. Regis: Well, it’s interesting. Most of the reputation of UNC came from its basketball program.
Dr. Necochea: Oh.
Dr. Regis: Oh yeah. And how it could beat Duke or North Carolina State. But at the time, we had one of the top stars uh… in ACC, was Charlie Scott, the first Black player, played at UNC. And he — he — I think he graduated the year – in ’69 – and then you had other Black stars that came in my class and in subsequent classes known in football and – By the way, the first Black quarterback to ever play in the ACC, played for a while at UNC. And one of the Black quarterbacks in major college football played for a while at UNC.
Dr. Necochea: Huh. That’s interesting. When you were here at UNC as an undergraduate, do you remember if there were already any enrichment programs for – you know — prospective medical students? Like nowadays, we have the MED Program, for example.
Dr. Regis: Yeah. In fact, somebody asked me this the other day because they forgot. There was a program that pre-dated the MED Program and I was one of the first students in it.
Dr. Necochea: What was it called?
Dr. Regis: The class was run by a guy named Hector Ferrias; he was Hispanic. And I forget the name of the program, but um… I was one of the few. They only had about 14 or 15 students in it, but we came in, we stayed in it during the summer, we took courses toward the medical school. It lasts for about four or five weeks, but it pre-dated the — the — the — What’s the program called now?
Dr. Necochea: The MED.
Dr. Regis: Well, it pre-dated – In fact, somebody called me a long time ago and said, “You know what? We found history that –” This program was probably in – And I don’t think it lasted more than two years before the MED started. It’s — I think it was in the summer of ’72.
Dr. Necochea: Interesting.
Dr. Regis: Oh yeah. And I was one of the first students in that program.
Dr. Necochea: Huh. That’s really interesting. I did not know that. I mean, I thought most of those –
Dr. Regis: Yeah. A lot of people think the MED was – I know, there was another program before that, that pre-dated and actually help set up what the MED was all about. I can’t think of the name of it. I remember Hector Ferrias and then there was a lady who helped run it who suddenly became a state representative from North Carolina, that helped the program. So, go back in your history books, historian. It’s there.
Dr. Necochea: Yeah. This is worth a look in the archives to see how far the MED history goes.
Dr. Regis: By the way, I think UNC was the only school — medical school in the state that had this program at that time.
Dr. Necochea: Wow. When you were getting – Sorry, quick back question; what was your favorite thing, uh — in terms of schoolwork, at UNC?
Dr. Regis: Course work?
Dr. Necochea: Yeah.
Dr. Regis: Oh history, without a doubt.
Dr. Necochea: Epic.
Dr. Regis: [Audio cuts out] and – What’s the term now for after the Civil War? Reconstruction period.Dr. Necochea: Uh huh.
Dr. Regis: And early 1900s.
Dr. Necochea: Wow.
Dr. Regis: That fascinated me, especially when it came to African Americans. That’s when Jim Crow was —
Dr. Necochea: Yeah.
Dr. Regis Solidified. It was right after slavery, so the Freedman’s Bureau and all that going on. In fact, I — I looked into how Black folks received healthcare in the time.
Dr. Necochea: Uh huh.
Dr. Regis: That was a huge interest of mine. But history was – By the way, you know the university has a great history department.
Dr. Necochea: Mm-hmm. Oh yeah. For sure. And it — when it comes to the history of the South, this is –
Dr. Regis: Absolutely. In fact, one of — a couple of my professors were famous; that wrote books. In fact, one of them was part of a huge uh — documentary on the Civil War. I can’t think of it – He’s passed away now, but the whole damn thing was all dependent on the work he had done.
Dr. Necochea: Wow.
Dr. Regis: Oh yeah.
Dr. Necochea: When you were, you know, getting close to the end of your studies here at UNC, were you thinking of applying to – uh – medical school right away or taking a break and doing something different?
Dr. Regis: Let me tell you how bizarre my story is. I used to love Chapel Hill that much, that we used to have so much fun, that I would stay up during the summer.
Dr. Necochea: Mm hmm.
Dr. Regis: And a group of us. And we would stay up and take summer school classes. And during that time, you could take four. Two in the first session and two in the second session.
Dr. Necochea: Oh, that’s a lot.
Dr. Regis: Oh yeah. I did that three summers in a row. So, I’d go to see my advisor at the end of my third year – end of my — Middle of my second year, and he said, “Well, you know you can graduate this year.” So, I actually graduated in three years.
Dr. Necochea: Oh wow.
Dr. Regis: Yeah. And when I found that out, it was too late to apply to medical school.
Dr. Necochea: Right.
Dr. Regis: That’s how bizarre my story is. So, you know what I did?
Dr. Necochea: What’d you do?
Dr. Regis: I got in grad school at the School of Public Health, which was one of the top in the nation.
Dr. Necochea: Oh, wow.
Dr. Regis: Yeah. So, I spent a year in public health, and during that year, I was in public health administration. I applied to med school, got in – And by the way, one of my major disappointments is I never finished the MPH.
Dr. Necochea: Oh, right. Right, right, right. You had enough time to take some of the courses and apply.
Dr. Regis: Oh yeah.
Dr. Necochea: Right. And this was before it got renamed as the Gilling’s School.
Dr. Regis: Yes. Oh yeah.
Dr. Necochea: Wow. What did you like taking over there the most?
Dr. Regis: I liked the — Believe it or not, I liked — My concentration – I wrote a paper on how the local health department’s role in primary care
Dr. Necochea: Cool.
Dr. Regis: At that time, because you know during that time, there were — there was – and possibly still is – and some local health departments actually became the outlet for primary care in certain uh — Black and brown and Indian communities in North Carolina.
Dr. Necochea: Huh. That is very interesting. It’s a very old school and a terrific school of public health, of course.
Dr. Regis: Absolutely. In fact, during that time, it was number two or number three in the nation. I believe it still is.
Dr. Necochea: Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It is. It’s a very strong space. When you were there – Nowadays, when medical students — well medical candidates apply, they apply to like, you know, 15-20 schools. Did you do the same?
Dr. Regis: You know, I don’t remember. I remember applying to Washington University, St. Louis University.
Dr. Necochea: Mm hmm.
Dr. Regis: Duke. UNC. And I think I applied to Howard. And — I think Georgetown, but that may have been undergrad because Georgetown was a Catholic University.
Dr. Necochea: Yes.
Dr. Regis: And um — and it’s interesting that one of the main reasons why I chose UNC – and I’m sure you’ve heard or talked to Marion Phillips.
Dr. Necochea: Hmm. No, I haven’t.
Dr. Regis: What?
Dr. Necochea: Tell me again. Marion Phillips. Marion Phillips.
Dr. Regis: Dr. Phillips was the first Black administrator in the medical school whose job was to try to recruit more Black medical students. He worked there for 20 years. You’ve never heard of him?
Dr. Necochea: I have, but –
Dr. Regis: And he’s still alive. And he’s still alive. You saw him at your wedding.
Dr. Necochea: What? Okay, wait.
Dr. Regis: Let me tell you something.
Dr. Necochea: Tell me.
Dr. Regis: Probably from 1969 to 1989, Dr. Phillips had more to do with Black medical students being successful at UNC than anybody else.
Dr. Necochea: This is great.
Dr. Regis: I can’t believe you’re just hearing about that name.
Dr. Necochea: Probably, his name –
Dr. Regis: He lives right next door to Allen!
Dr. Necochea: Allen Mask? I don’t think you mentioned him.
Dr. Regis: Yes!
Dr. Necochea: I’m going to check him out.
Dr. Regis: Oh my God. In fact, he was at the – When I was there, I hadn’t seen him in 11 or more years. He was at the wedding. We all — we all — we had a blast. But he was – a University of Chicago, a PhD in philosophy.
Dr. Necochea: Uh-huh.
Dr. Regis: He was a very, very, very uh — uh — you know, educated gentleman that the UNC School of Medicine hired.
Dr. Necochea: Mm hmm.
Dr. Regis: In fact, at one while, he would have been the Assistant Dean of Students. He — he — he was around for at least 20 years. He helped start the NMA.
Dr. Necochea: Ah, right. This is — Okay, no. I’m sorry. I take that back. I do know Marion Phillips. Dr. Phillips pre-dates me by, you know, quite a few years.
Dr. Regis: Oh yeah. He’s been out of the medical school now for at least 25 – But — but… Let me tell you, during the ‘70s and ‘80s, every Black student there got touched by him.
Dr. Necochea: Yes. He was — he was the Associate Dean here in the med school.
Dr. Regis: Exactly.
Dr. Necochea: Yeah. Of course, I remember him, and he was very involved with medical education before the School of Medicine, you know, got involved into – before we became UNC Health and started including the hospital and everything else. When we were just medical school related.
Dr. Regis: Exactly. He was — he — he was one of the originators of — very much involved in MED program, very much involved in the recruitment and retention of Black medical students.
Dr. Necochea: Yeah.
Dr. Regis: In fact, his — his — his role should be historic, really.
Dr. Necochea: Yeah. Exactly.
Dr. Regis: And now… there was a weirdness going on near the end of his career. One of the Deans — he didn’t get along with and he left, but let me tell you, in terms of Black students, he’s probably the most important player in the history of that medical school, even to this day.
Dr. Necochea: Yeah. That’s great. I think — This is great. Every interview that we do, it has bits like this where you discover things that are not covered by the historical record terribly well, including more of this. I want to get to the — you know — the recruitment of more African American students as we move into the 1970s, and for that I need your part getting into this. Um. Would you please tell me a little bit, if — if — if — if someone in particular encouraged you to apply here to the medical school, or — or the opposite, if anyone discouraged you.
Dr. Regis: No. The only one who encouraged me — it was Dr. Phillips.
Dr. Necochea: Mm hmm.
Dr. Regis: Dr. Phillips would come in and talk to you in the MED Program.
Dr. Necochea: Oh. Or — or, you know the version of the MED that you participated in.
Dr. Regis: Yeah. Yeah. And when it became the MED. But he was very much involved in coming in and — and — and — and having formal conversations with the class with him about the — you know — the need for more Black doctors and why don’t you stay here at UNC.
Dr. Necochea: Yeah. Did you have the option of attending a different medical school?
Dr. Regis: You know what, I think I got accepted into two other medical – St. Louis University, Howard. I didn’t — you know, it was really weird. I don’t know if I applied to that many medical schools.
Dr. Necochea: Mm hmm.
Dr. Regis: We — we, later on, Allen uh — and Dr. Phillips – Because we used to, every day, call. “Did we get in?” I can remember. Allen and I laugh about it to this day. “Did we get in?” “Did we get in?” And, you know… It — it — when we did get in, it was uh natural. We were local, North Carolina guys whose parents taught and whose parents fought for this country. We should have been there. So we — we — we — And let me tell you something, and I don’t know how to say this – Some of the best times of my life were at Chapel Hill. The the best years of my life, before I had children, before it was spent.
My undergrad years were fabulous. I never ran into any abject racism that I could see to tell you. There was probably a lot of behind stuff going on.
Dr. Necochea: Mm hmm.
Dr. Regis: But I was so oblivious to it, and I did pretty well in undergrad. Did pretty well in med school. I wasn’t in the top of the class, but I wasn’t in the bottom of the class, by far. So, my experience in Chapel Hill, even during those early days was fabulous. In fact, we used to go over and bring students from Howard. They would come over and party with us from North Carolina Central, Winston-Salem State, North Carolina A&T. It was just a different time, man.
Dr. Necochea: Yeah. That is so cool. Well, you know… And your class was also special. In ‘78, ’79, there were – I was tracking the number of admitted African American medical students and it jumped significantly for your class.
Dr. Regis: Yeah. Yeah. In fact… In fact, it may be that I’m talking about the medical school instead of undergrad – That we had one of the largest classes, I think, to this day. I can’t remember whether it’s undergrad or med school, but we had a large class.
Dr. Necochea: I can’t say about the undergraduate, but I have the data for the medical school and it’s – uh… Yeah, there were — and these were number… the only the people who were alive and contactable in 2022, but there’s at least 15 people in that class.
Dr. Regis: I think we had somewhere in the twenties.
Dr. Necochea: Yeah. I believe you. There may be some who are no longer reachable.
Dr. Regis: Yeah. That’s interesting.
Dr. Necochea: That leap is important, right. And you probably noticed, as you came in, that your class was bigger, whereas the — you know — classes that were older were not as big.
Dr. Regis: Yeah. We did notice that. And we got to be friends and we studied together, we uh partied together, and we all had similar life backgrounds, really. In fact, some of our classmates who were there with us, went to UNC. Allen and I, maybe two other – What was his name? Jesus Christ. Maybe it was only one other at that time. Three of us at the university were from UNC, but the rest of them were from different schools around the state and the country.
Dr. Necochea: Hmm. And um… Of course, you mentioned you were friends with Dr. Allen Mask from your class. Do you remember the faculty and the administrators who were also close to you?
Dr. Regis: Oh yeah. In fact, let me tell you who – During that time, neuroanatomy and neurophysiology was one of the hardest courses – If I had told you that – and it was Dr. Pearl. Have you ever talked to Dr. Pearl?
Dr. Necochea: Pearl? Nope. He was not — he was not reachable. No not…
Dr. Regis: He was a nationally known expert, neurophysiologist, and everybody didn’t like his class, but I was fascinated by it. He had this habit that at the end of the year or the end of the course, he would write letters to the top students uh saying uh, “You did really well.” And I got one of those letters.
Dr. Necochea: Wow! That is so cool.
Dr. Regis: Oh yeah. And then there was Dr. Gottschalk, who was someone that renal physiology countercurrent mechanisms was named after him. Then there was Dr. Mandel, who was a famous surgeon who operated on my mom.
Dr. Necochea: Wow.
Dr. Regis: Yeah. And then — and then um — Jesus Christ, who was the guy who was in radiology? He was world famous, but he was funny.
Dr. Necochea: Oh. Was it Scatliff?
Dr. Regis: Yeah!
Dr. Necochea: Yeah. Jim Scat—
Dr. Regis: I remember the time he threw up a picture of a Playboy model in the class went wild and the girls didn’t like it. This was before the feminist movement now.
Dr. Necochea: Right.
Dr. Regis: So, he put those slides up of different you know… radiology pictures and x-rays at that time, and every now and then, he would — he threw up a slide that had a Playboy Bunny. And our class was probably one of the first class that didn’t think it was cool, especially the women, because there were a lot in that class. And I think that was the last year he ever did that.
Dr. Necochea: You know, there are some changes that are for the better.
Dr. Regis: I just thought about that. I haven’t thought about that in 40 years.
Dr. Necochea: So, if we split your medical studies into, you know, the first half, with all of the classroom learning, and the tough pathophysiology, the long hours of studying, and then the clinical years. What would you say the best part and the most challenging part was of the first years?
Dr. Regis: That’s a very good question because I don’t think any of them were challenging. I loved it all.
Dr. Necochea: Oh, wonderful.
Dr. Regis: Mid-level. I was right in the core. I was in the top 20% of the class – 30%, 25% – and I don’t remember any class being that difficult. I had great instructors in cell biology. I had Dr. Hollingshead who wrote the textbook for anatomy, as my anatomy instructor. He looked at — he wrote one of the seminal texts of gross anatomy. Dr. Hollingshead. I think I still got the book. I think it’s around here. Yeah. UNC had great professors, man. It still does.
Dr. Necochea: Yeah. Yeah, tell me about it. [Both laughing].
Dr. Regis: Yeah. I’m just trying to think of some of the names, but I enjoyed all of my classes immensely, and found the neurophysiology – the ones that are the most challenging, I — something clicked. I just got into them. And uh… The pathophysiology of disease, who taught that? Oh my God. To really get into what was the pathophysiology, what was really going on in the body when you had a pneumonia. Uh uh… oh my — It was fascinating, and I had a great time. I had great professors, that had no trace that I knew of, no evidence, of any kind of racist anything.
Dr. Necochea: That is very, very good to hear. I’m very glad to hear that.
Dr. Regis: Now it could be that we were such a select group of students and we were in there – and I’m sure there’s people that had different experiences. See, I wasn’t looking for it and I didn’t grow up in it.
Dr. Necochea: Mmm. Right, and that’s also important to consider, right?
Dr. Regis: The other thing was, that was very important, and I didn’t realize — maybe I — I always — I grew up in a very integrated environment. I never went with all Blacks. I lived in an all-Black neighborhood, but the next neighborhood over, we played with them, and they were all White. So, I was used to dealing with White culture.
Dr. Necochea: Mm hmm.
Dr. Regis: When I went to Carolina, it was — it was nothing new to me. But for a lot it was a problem. Trust me.
Dr. Necochea: Right. I — I — I get that. That familiarity and that lack of – that unsurprised-ness of yours —
Dr. Regis: Yes!
Dr. Necochea: When you came into this environment was — you know. It – it’s – it arms you well.
Dr. Regis: When I went to undergrad, and when I went to grade school in St. Anne’s Catholic school – I think uh — out of the whole school – it was a small school. There were only like 11 or 12 Blacks in the whole school when I was going. Had a great time. Best basketball player. [Both laugh]. But I’m just telling you, I was never in an all-Black environment. Never. So, when I got to Chapel Hill, I was used to interacting – and see, a lot of times, back in those days, the problem wasn’t so much uh — uh — Jim Crow in the medical school, or really racism in your face, it’s that some people had a difficult time adjusting to that White environment, where it was no problem to me. None whatsoever.
Dr. Necochea: Right. This is, of course – racism on its own, it’s a major, you know, personal and structural issue. But on top of that, you have – you know – it – it’s just tough. This is a difficult course of study. It’s stressful. Put in the long hours. The material can be tough. How did you feel about, you know, all of that? Was there a time when you needed some help?
Dr. Regis: The only time that I needed help was in the year when I didn’t match.
Dr. Necochea: Mmm. Oh, okay. Wait. Let me get to that in a moment um because I want to ask you first about the other major part of uh… your training, which is – well, you had to take a USMLE exam first, right?
Dr. Regis: Yeah.
Dr. Necochea: As you know, it’s a major rite of passage. It’s difficult. Quite stressful for all of our students in the second year. How did that go for you?
Dr. Regis: Allen and I had a schedule; we would get up and meet to study from 8:00 to 12:00. Have lunch. Study from 1:00 until 5:00. Have dinner, and study from 6:00 until 12:00.
Dr. Necochea: Wow.
Dr. Regis: [Audio cuts out] [00:42:27] Literally, our next-door neighbors say too, “When I would get up in the morning, I would see you and Allen at your kitchen table studying. When I would go to bed at night, you’d be at the kitchen table studying.” But that bred a friendship that lasts to this day, and also, we didn’t have any problems with those exams.
Dr. Necochea: Mm-hmm. Wow. Geez, that’s intense. And that’s the prepping then and there?
Dr. Regis: It was intense, but I loved it. In fact, is used to – let me tell you, I have most of my old textbooks. I would write in the margins, “Allen and I are up studying now. It’s 10:20. We’re studying anatomy.” I can go through my textbooks now and look at some of those notes I just put in there like that and it’s amazing.
Dr. Necochea: That’s great.
Dr. Regis: I would put the time and the date. “Allen and I just finished dinner and now we’re going to study pathology.” It’s a little something I did.
Dr. Necochea: Wow. Um. And now moving on to, of course, part two of being on rotations, being in wards, being in different services, um, starting over again every few weeks. Um. Tell me a little about your experience rotating.
Dr. Regis: Rotations were the only time I got a feeling that I was different.
Dr. Necochea: Mm hmm.
Dr. Regis: But it wasn’t intense. In fact, one of the best experiences – I don’t know if they still do that, but back during the day, as a third year, you got to go out to the AHEC. Or you went out to a local family practice doc.
Dr. Necochea: Yup.
Dr. Regis: And spent – yeah. Well, I got sent out to a – I’m sure this guy had never seen anybody White near him — uh Black near him, but he agreed to do the program. This guy had his own plane, little plane. He lived — it was somewhere outside of Raleigh, in the rural areas. And I used to drive up there and I would go into rooms. This Black guy, medical student, with this White guy, must have been in his late 50s, would take me in with his White patients and I didn’t have any problem at all.
I remember staying up there, he called me at 4:00 in the morning because some guy had beat his wife to death.
Dr. Necochea: Jeez.
Dr. Regis: And he was the local medical examiner. He had to get up and go in to pronounce. And he called me, “You need to have this experience.”
Dr. Necochea: Wow.
Dr. Regis: I’ll never forget it. Never. And I can’t think of his name now. But let me tell you something, how that guy dealt with me as a Black medical student – and I know he had never been that close to anybody at that level who was Black – now, he probably had some Black patients, I’m sure. Uh… But it was transcendent experience for the both of us because we’d sit down and talk.
Dr. Necochea: Yeah. Wow. What did you talk about?
Dr. Regis: Well, he was — he couldn’t believe I grew up the way I grew up in terms of my father in the Army and World War II and Korea, and — and — and my mother having a Master’s degree, and my sisters having Master’s degrees. And all of my friends who went to college. He said, “Damn, that isn’t even what I had when I grew up.” He said, “I only had two or three friends around me that went to college.”
Dr. Necochea: Wow. I get it that the existence of a Black, middle-class, it was news.
Dr. Regis: And let me tell you, in North Carolina, in most communities that had the HBCU’s.
Dr. Necochea: Mm hmm.
Dr. Regis: It was all Black, middle-class.
Dr. Necochea: Right.
Dr. Regis: It had to be.
Dr. Necochea: Yeah.
Dr. Regis: It had to be.
Dr. Necochea: Wow.
Dr. Regis: By the way, that’s a story that has yet to be told.
Dr. Necochea: HBCUs?
Dr. Regis: Well, no. How HBCUs promoted and sustained Black culture and Black class back during those days.
Dr. Necochea: Yeah. I agree with you.
Dr. Regis: By the way, even before. Even back during the ‘30s and the ‘40s.
Dr. Necochea: Mm-hmm. Yeah.
Dr. Regis: Those universities were the beginning to get a job that paid reasonable money if you were, you know — The segregated school system needed Black teachers.
Dr. Necochea: Mm-hmm.
Dr. Regis: By the way, most of the HBCUs in North Carolina, they primarily — they started as ways to teach Black folks to teach in Black schools.
Dr. Necochea: Mm-hmm.
Dr. Regis: Fayetteville State. Elizabeth City State. St. Aug. Johnson C. Smith. All of them were teacher’s colleges.
Dr. Necochea: Mm-hmm. Yeah.
Dr. Regis: Just saying. Just saying.
Dr. Necochea: Yeah. I think — no, you’re absolutely right. Yeah. A lot of folks that I have interviewed – In many ways, you’re very unique, I mean, because you went straight into UNC for undergraduate. But several of the people that we’ve interviewed for this project, they attended HBCUs, and their parents went to HBCUs when they went. Yeah. So like the structural… The scaffolding provided by HBCUs for many of these docs that we are interviewing as part of this project, it’s — I mean, it’s — it’s undeniable.
Dr. Regis: You know what’s interesting? During that time, some of the most elite students uh… went to HBCUs.
Dr. Necochea: Mm hmm.
Dr. Regis: And now HBCUs offer to get elite students – it’s coming back that way, by the way.
Dr. Necochea: Mm hmm.
Dr. Regis: But they were the colleges that Black students went to that got shunned by the larger Black universities.
Dr. Necochea: Mm-hmm.
Dr. Regis: And, and — It’s just fascinating if you look at the story — the story — the history of HBCUs. Especially the history of HBCUs in North Carolina.
Dr. Necochea: Yeah. Indeed. And back to your time going through all of these different rotations and meeting docs in their — in their natural habitat, I guess. How did you start zeroing in on possible specialties?
Dr. Regis: You know, somebody always asking me, “Why would a man go into OB/GYN?” And what I liked about it was it was a defined specialty. I think I could know everything there was about it. So, if I ever went to the emergency room, I would never be surprised by what I saw, and it was true. The other thing is they had a surgical component and I was — and I was good – I had a great bedside manner and diagnosing skills, which I find in most African American physicians are actually known for that. We’re some of the best diagnosticians out there. That I’ve been in all hospitals, and I could tell you this – and I hate to say it, there’s certain ethnic groups that excel in certain things. And I — It’s fasc — It’s a fascinating, anecdotal – to say the least – observation.
So, that’s how I narrowed down that specialty. Uh. Plus, I thought childbirth was such a intimate experience.
Dr. Necochea: Mm hmm.
Dr. Regis: You couldn’t get much closer to a patient than carrying her through that experience.
Dr. Necochea: Right.
Dr. Regis: The other thing was that most of the GYN cancers, if discovered early enough, were treatable. Even to this day. So, it was a fairly happy profession.
Dr. Necochea: I — I — I quite agree with you. When things go well, that birth is just – you know — yeah, nothing beats it. Yeah. Um. How did you — Was there someone in particular who encouraged you to move into this direction? Um… Or —
Dr. Regis:No.
Dr. Necochea:No?
Dr. Regis: Not that I can think of.
Dr. Necochea: This was you?
Dr. Regis: Now, let me tell you something; there was a Black oncologist, Dr. Fowler, who was at UNC. One of the few Black oncologists at that time. No, Fowler was not… Fowler was the Black – there was a Black GYN oncologist.
Dr. Necochea: Right. Fowler was an OB/GYN, but he’s White.
Dr. Regis: Yes. He was the — the head of the oncology program. There was — there was — I’m going back now into the ‘80s and maybe up to early ‘90s and early ‘80s. There was a Black GYN oncologist that we got to know because he was one of the few Black professors.
Dr. Necochea: Huh.
Dr. Regis: I can’t think of his name now. But I remember Fowler because Fowler was the White guy that was either head of the department or head of GYN oncology, which is strange.
Dr. Necochea: Right. Him I know.
Dr. Regis: Yeah.
Dr. Necochea: In fact, he’s the one who gave me your name.
Dr. Regis: Really?
Dr. Necochea: Yes. Butch Fowler is the — right now, he directs our Office of Alumni Affairs.
Dr. Regis: Butch. That is exactly right. Butch Fowler. Wow.
Dr. Necochea: Yeah. I know. You are a part of history there, uh, Dr. Regis. So, tell me about applying to residency.
Dr. Regis: I’m going to tell you what happened that was – only a few incidents that I had heard that were somewhat racist.
Dr. Necochea: Mm hmm.
Dr. Regis: I only applied to four or five programs and… You know, but I didn’t apply to Carolina’s OB program. That was really weird. Well, I wanted to go to uh… University of Virginia… I mean, uh MCB.
Dr. Necochea: Mm hmm.
Dr. Regis: And the year before MCB had nationals, all their spots went to Black graduates, just by chance.
Dr. Necochea: Wow.
Dr. Regis: Yes. They took in four or five residents a year and that year every resident they took in the match was African American. Isn’t that interesting?
Dr. Necochea: Wow. That’s pretty historic.
Dr. Regis: Well, they were gonna make sure that didn’t happen next year.
Dr. Necochea: Oh.
Dr. Regis: So, I ended up not matching, which ended up being one of the best things that ever happened to me.
Dr. Necochea: Why?
Dr. Regis: I ended up going to Philadelphia and uh totally foreign experience. Big city with people getting burned up every day in fires and sirens going off and this abject, generational poverty. I’d never seen that growing up. Delivering moms who — uh — I kept saying — I used to say, “Is anybody here married?” Seriously, that’s how naïve I was and how I grew up differently. So, it — it was — the transition to Philadelphia was not hard, it was just very interesting. Fascinating.
Dr. Necochea: What were you doing in Philly?
Dr. Regis: You paid $600,000 or $700,000 to live right next door to somebody. A row home, a row home, for instance. They would have – they would have million-dollar row homes in Philly, and you were attached to another home. To me, that was insane.
Dr. Necochea: What were you doing in Philly?
Dr. Regis: I did residency.
Dr. Necochea: Oh. In — In — In —
Dr. Regis: In Philly.
Dr. Necochea: In Philly? Okay.
Dr. Regis: I did. Hahnemann Hospital, which then became Drexel. Hahnemann Drexel.
Dr. Necochea: Okay.
Dr. Regis: And I did residency there.
Dr. Necochea: Oh. Okay. Okay. That’s the part that I missed. So, that’s where you did residency.
Dr. Regis: Yep.
Dr. Necochea: And it’s a four-year residency, right?
Dr. Regis: Oh, yeah. And we would rotate — We rotated to several hospitals, even into New Jersey. In fact, I ended up living and staying and starting my business in New Jersey.
Dr. Necochea: Oh.
Dr. Regis: New Jersey is right across the river from Philadelphia. It’s surrounding the Delaware River. Very unique. I didn’t even realize that till I got up here.
Dr. Necochea: So, you moved up north and you kind of stayed up north.
Dr. Regis: Yeah. And if you’d have told me, when I moved up there, that I would end up living the rest of my life in norther — in the northern part of the United States, I would have shot you because I was a southerner. I would have said, “Ain’t no way in hell.” But life is – there’s a way.
Dr. Necochea: Mm-hmm. Tell me about your most influential career mentors when you were over doing residency.
Dr. Regis: Oh, Thompson Leichik. Thompson Leichik was the head of the department. He was a pretty famous GYN oncologist.
Dr. Necochea: Uh-huh.
Dr. Regis: In fact, he was the one that pioneered the original work on uh — uh — Gardasil, the vaccine for –
Dr. Necochea: Cool.
Dr. Regis: Oh yeah. Um. And uh… He was. And also, Earl Ringwald, Jewish physician that was uh… an expert witness also.
Dr. Necochea: Huh.
Dr. Regis: And then there were a couple of female — Delphine Bartosik.
Dr. Necochea: Mm hmm.
Dr. Regis: Was an infertility specialist, because at one while, I played around with going to do a fellowship in fertility. In fact, I even applied —
Dr. Necochea: Huh.
Dr. Regis: And interviewed at Duke and at University of Pennsylvania, which were the top infertility programs in the country.
Dr. Necochea: Wow.
Dr. Regis: Oh yeah. Luigi Mastroianni was the head of infertility at University of Pennsylvania. He was famous. Famous, worldwide, for the work he did.
Dr. Necochea: Wow.
Dr. Regis: And I remember going down and interviewing at Duke for infertility. But then as I was starting to get serious and I said, “No, I’m not gonna do that much school, I’ll be a general OB/GYN.”
Dr. Necochea: Was there a moment in your residency training, or maybe after, when you — when you felt that you came into your own as a medical professional?
Dr. Regis: Let me tell you what did happen.
Dr. Necochea: Mm hmm.
Dr. Regis: And Philadelphia has several great medical schools: Thomas Jefferson University, University of Pennsylvania, uh… Temple, uh… Main Line. They were doing top medical schools in the country, with several right there in Philadelphia. Well, Hahnemann Drexel, where I went to, was lower tier. Out of the top six, they were like the fifth. Well, every year they used to have – the OB/GYN program used to get the other to have a resident’s bowl where they would pick out the top two residents from the senior class to compete. It was almost like a quiz show and the residents would come together, and we have various activities and then at the end of the day, you were on stage with a buzzer till one of the professors would ask questions, and you would – that resident was the resident of the year. Well, I got asked in my sophomore year.
Dr. Necochea: Whoa.
Dr. Regis: To represent them and I won it.
Dr. Necochea: Nice. Congratulations.
Dr. Regis: I even remember the winning question. It was — it was “What change in the –” They were trying to make oral contraceptives more – well, that you could take them orally and they had to have an addition of the ethinyl group onto the estrogen molecule and it was interesting about that. I had just read that while studying for this contest that night. The last thing I read was that. So, when I got up there to answer the question, I slammed the buzzer down. The guy looked at me all aggressive. But I won that competition. That’s when I knew I could hang with the big boys. Ivy League, UPenn, and from an academic standpoint, I always knew I excelled. Once I hit the wards, boy, it’s my personality. Wherever I went, from high school, I — I — I was at the top. I was very friendly, made friends. I was always uh in that clique that ran everything. You know? You get what I’m saying?
Dr. Necochea: Uh-huh. Yeah.
Dr. Regis: But that let me know – Even when I was at Carolina. We would uh — Allen will tell you. But it was uh that experience that let me know that I could hang with anybody.
Dr. Necochea: That — that — that’s really funny in a way. I mean the — Hitting that buzzer harder and faster than anyone.
Dr. Regis: One of the guys next to me, he said something that was — that was — that was somewhat racist. He said, “Man, you’re so quick. Did you play basketball?” [Laughs].
Dr. Necochea: Oh, gosh.
Dr. Regis: I remember to this day. No, man. But the other thing is, you’ve got to understand, most of those guys were senior residents. I was only finishing my second year.
Dr. Necochea: Mm hmm.
Dr. Regis: And I —
Dr. Necochea: Right.
Dr. Regis: And the head of the department chose me to do that.
Dr. Necochea: Mm-hmm. So, a surprise to the other players on several fronts.
Dr. Regis: I can remember that — that — after that competition was over, several professors from Penn came over to meet me. And you know, Penn still has one of the top OB programs in the country, if not the top – Penn and John Hopkins. In the country.
Dr. Necochea: Yeah. Um. Dr. Regis, this interview, as I’ve mentioned, it covers mainly, you know, those critical training years as a medical student and as a resident. And you know, we — Going over your whole career would be too much of a job for this, but it’s also important for students to hear about, you know, you being a Black physician, and I would like to conclude by asking you, you know, how does being a Black physician matter in your community?
Dr. Regis: Well see, it — I was — See, I was always – since I had a business, I had 150 staff and 40 docs in
[01:01:54] that worked at my company.Dr. Necochea: Mm hmm.
Dr. Regis: So, I was really always high profile. I ran it for 30 years.
Dr. Necochea: Mm hmm.
Dr. Regis: So, I was one of the top docs, Black or White.
Dr. Necochea: Mm hmm.
Dr. Regis: In fact, nobody – I was one of the few physicians, in — in —no matter what you were, that ran a business that large. So, it was a unique position to be able to see what the strengths and the weaknesses of our healthcare delivery system.
Dr. Necochea: Mm hmm.
Dr. Regis: And so, being a Black doctor, who ran a Black business in several different cities – I had 18 offices.
Dr. Necochea: Mm hmm.
Dr. Regis: In different cities in Jersey.
I was able to go from, as I said, density of probably Newark to some of the more rural areas. There were migrant farm workers, to some of the most exclusive zero towns, taking care of patients.
Dr. Necochea: Mm hmm.
Dr. Regis: Where the homes there was two and three million a piece on the Jersey Shore. So, my experience, again, was very unique.
Dr. Necochea: Mm hmm.
Dr. Regis: That I was — I was looked upon as rare, uh… that stuck out, and meeting some hospital executives – because at that time, thirty years ago, there wasn’t anybody who looked like me.
Dr. Necochea: Mm hmm.
Dr. Regis: By the way, to this day, there ain’t not many who do the entrepreneurial — who did an entrepreneurial thing in medicine.
Dr. Necochea: Yeah.
Dr. Regis: You know?
Dr. Necochea: Yeah.
Dr. Regis: I was hiring other docs. A lot of docs I was hiring were White.
Dr. Necochea: I forgot — this is — I — I — I would like to go back over your experience being an executive of the Reliance Medical Group. Um. And for, you know, the people who are going to be listening to this and reading the transcript along, can you tell us a little bit about how it came about? How did Reliance Medical Group um start?
Dr. Regis: Well… I assure you. There was a problem in major cities in New Jersey covering poor women.
Dr. Necochea: Mm hmm.
Dr. Regis: And during pregnancies. Because they would have to rely on the private guys to come in – who would deliver them in hospital – because some of them and their medical staff, credentialing, they would have to cover the ward service for a month. And some of these clinics were delivering over 1,000 deliveries a year. They were busy. The private guys had to almost leave their practice to cover. They fought. Revolted.
And one hospital administrator said – He knew I was an — an — a professor, and I had a small practice, and I was doing some — some coverage in certain places, me and a couple other guys. He said, “Can you come in?” “What’s the problem?” I went down and looked at him, and he gave me a check for a million bucks.
Dr. Necochea: Whoa.
Dr. Regis: Yes. He said — I — I — Because I told him – I said, “Look, if you support it, I will have private docs come down here and take care of this population, but we’re not going to call the clinic and you’re not going to limit me to pri— to Medicaid patients. If I come down here and start a practice, the name of your clinic’s going to change to Reliance. It’s going to be a private practice like everybody else’s. We’re going to take care of these patients and see other patients.” And he agreed. And he was the laughingstock of the hospital administrators for two years. He gave two Black guys from Camden a million bucks. But by the third or fourth year, those hospitals were calling me because I had solved the problem. That’s how I ended up doing 7,000 deliveries a year in New Jersey.
Dr. Necochea: Hmm. You and that team of docs.
Dr. Regis: Well, at one time I had 60 full and part-time OB/GYN docs across New Jersey.
Dr. Necochea: Huh. Wow. Over your whole — and — and — Wait doc, so when was that, that Reliance –
Dr. Regis: We started that, probably, in 1990, ‘89, ’90.
Dr. Necochea: ’89, ’90.
Dr. Regis: And then it grew, it grew and I said, “Well, I got to take care of these babies.” So, I started pediatrics.
Dr. Necochea: Mm hmm.
Dr. Regis: Then I said, “I got to take care of the moms and their husbands or their boyfriends.” So, we’ll see them all. So, Reliance, at the end, when I sold it, it was a multi-specialty, primary care group. We had peds, OB/GYN, and adult medicine.
Dr. Necochea: Yeah. And you’re still working?
Dr. Regis:Well, well, what happened was, the company that bought me wanted me to stay on as a consultant, and right now I’m not seeing patients now. I’m consulting, bringing other physicians in, doing their health policy. They have a — they have a whole set division that’s in D.C looking at health policy.
Dr. Necochea: Mm-hmm.
Dr. Regis: Because VillageMD’s one of the largest physician groups in the country. Uh… They’re the one that got the $6 billion investment from Walgreens to put in these co-located clinics into Walgreens. I’m actually on the committee that’s selecting some of them.
Dr. Necochea: Hmm.
Dr. Regis: But these aren’t mini clinics. These are full-fledged, six exam room, 7:00 a.m. to 7:00 p.m., a doc and nurse practitioner in them every day. There —- There — The lady from Walgreens – by the way, Walgreens is headed up by Roz Brewster… Uh, Brewer. She’s one of two African American females to head up a Fortune 500 company. So, she gave Village $6 billion to start these co-located clinics, 1000 of them. Fifty percent — fifty one percent had to be in geographically underserved areas.
Dr. Necochea: Wow.
Dr. Regis: That’s the power of having uh — uh — diversity at the top.
Dr. Necochea: Yeah, exactly. And it’s why one seeks it in many ways.
Dr. Regis: Exactly.
Dr. Necochea:Yeah.
Dr. Regis: It was a different perspective. Just willing to put money behind it.
Dr. Necochea: Exactly.
Dr. Regis: And now it’s getting national accolades behind. Now CVS is trying to do it. Amazon is trying to do it. [Both laugh]. Trust me. Let me tell you one interesting story, then I got to go. We can talk more whenever you need me.
Dr. Necochea: Of course. Tell me.
Dr. Regis: I came down one year – This national medical – the SNMA in Chapel Hill invited me down to speak. This was – God, it probably was in the early ‘90s.
Dr. Necochea: Huh.
Dr. Regis: Early. And I came down and was telling the story of my company, and there was a guy in the audience who was three or four years younger than me, from Raleigh. He was an OB/GYN doc practicing in Rochester, New York, and he heard me speak. In six months, he left Rochester and joined me in New Jersey. Louis Wesley. Graduated from Chapel Hill, probably, med school in maybe ’84.
Dr. Necochea: Uh huh.
Dr. Regis: And then did his residency at University of Rochester, which is an excellent OB/GYN program.
Dr. Necochea: Mm hmm.
Dr. Regis: At [inaudible] hall, before the SNMA. We both was Carolina graduates – heard me speak and decided to leave and come join me. Worked for me for the next 25 years. Two — two Carolina boys. [Both laughing]. How’s that for a story?
Dr. Necochea: Yeah. Well, glad you came back. At least there is that after you left us. Um… Dr. Regis, this has been a pleasure and I’m so glad that I’ve spoken with you. It’s helped me fill in so many important gaps in our story here at UNC. And um… Yeah, I really appreciate it.
Dr. Regis: No problem. Anytime. And I’d make sure that the medical students learn more about health policy.Dr. Necochea: I will.
Dr. Regis: How — how — how do we pay for medicine and what to expect when they leave out of — out of um… residency. There should be some courses or some seminars in that.
Dr. Necochea: Indeed. Thank you very much, Dr. Regis.
Dr. Regis: Alright. Great.
[End of Audio]
Duration: 70 minutes
Dr. Necochea: I am recording now. Today is Monday, the 24th of October of 2022. I am doing an addendum to the interview with Dr. Jon Regis. Good morning, Dr. Regis.
Dr. Regis: Good morning. How are you?
Dr. Necochea: I’m well, thank you. How are you?
Dr. Regis: Yeah, I just had to call back and – and tell this little bit of information that happened to me my freshman year in 1977 when I was at Carolina, and it had happened in class but it typified the – I – I guess my personality and some of the – how a negative can turn into a positive. And what happened, I was in class, a history class, and I can’t remember the professor’s name, whether it was Sanders, but you know he was very well known, nationally and and locally and he came to class. And I always thought this guy came to class, he had – he would – had been drinking or – or something, and I – but I never knew that for a fact.
But he would come to class and he would start spinning these yarns and telling tales about what he had done over the weekend before he got to his lessons. And he came in this one day, of course, I’m the only black student in the class and the class probably got about 25 students in it, and I’m sitting up front which I normally would do. And he comes in and he says, “Well, guys, I was at – I was up in the mountains in this real rural area of – of the Great Smokies and you know they found out that I was a college professor at UNC and they gave me a hard time about me up here teaching and uh – all those socialists and communists and also teaching all those ni##ers.”
Dr. Necochea: Oh.
Dr. Regis: Yes, he did, he said that in class. And the class fell silent. And he – you know – I don’t know if he was looking to get my reaction or didn’t know what he said. So anyway, I said to the class, “Well, you know what, that’s interesting, you know I was in that same area of the mountains about a week ago and nobody ever said that to me.” The class fell out. He almost fell out of his seat laughing. I – I – I – I said “You know what, it’s interesting, I was in the same area and nobody ever said that to me, and they found out I was from Carolina, they never said that to me.” [Both laughing.]
And – and let me tell you, it was such a moment that broke the whatever that was that was trying to happen and that the class fell out laughing. I mean I even got folks coming up to me up in class saying “Where did you come up with that line?” And so and by the way, I was earning a healthy C+. At the end of the course, well, he gave me an A, which I did not deserve, which I did not deserve. [Both laughing.]
But I had to tell it because let me tell you something. If I had been a different person and not used to being in that environment, although that was pretty stark, but my personality said, you know what – um… and that was real, I said, “Well, you know what, nobody ever said that to me and I was in that same” – and I was! A couple weeks ago, that same area of North Carolina myself with some friends going up in the mountains and nobody ever said that to me.
Hold on one second. Can you –?
Dr. Necochea: Yes.
Dr. Regis: Hold on. [People speaking in the background, off mid-inaudible] [00:03:25]. So, what do you think of that?
Dr. Necochea: That’s hilarious. I’m – it sounds like a moment of catharsis that the whole class was tensely sort of –
Dr. Regis: Hey – you know what? Can I give you a call back? I’m actually getting a car; my car is in the shop.
Dr. Necochea: Oh, yes. I mean –.
Dr. Regis: But that – that’s a great story.
Dr. Necochea: It is a great story, and yeah, please, any time, feel free to call me. I love talking to you.
Dr. Regis: I will.
Dr. Necochea: I hope you have a great day and great week, Dr. Regis.
Dr. Regis: Same to you. Okay, okay.
Dr. Necochea: Bye.
Dr. Regis: Bye-bye.
[End of Audio]
Duration: 4 minutes
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About
Dr Jon Regis, a first-generation physician, was born and raised in Fort Bragg, NC. He describes his upbringing as much different from those of other Black Americans. He attended integrated primary schools, lived in an Army-centered community, and did not experience the typical segregation or racism of that era due to the military lifestyle. Growing up, his parents instilled the value of education in him, especially since his mother was a schoolteacher. He became interested in medicine because his friend’s father was one of the first Black doctors in Fayetteville, NC. He started undergraduate studies at UNC Chapel Hill in 1970. During his time there, he knew he wanted to pursue medical school and graduated early because he enjoyed learning and taking extra courses. He then pursued an MPH at UNC’s School of Public Health, but changed courses to pursue an MD. He enrolled in UNC School of Medicine in 1974 and continued to find joy in all of his courses. While in medical school, he was in the top 20-30% of his class and found the typical challenging courses to be the most fascinating. He continued to thrive and was well-liked by his classmates, never experiencing any abject racism from his peers or professors. After graduating from UNC Chapel Hill, he pursued a residency at Hahnemann Hospital and Medical Center in Philadelphia, Pennsylvania and fell in love with the Northeast despite his strong Southern roots. He continued to excel academically in his residency program and specialized in OB/GYN. After becoming an OB/GYN, he was committed to fixing the physician shortage and providing cost-effective care in urban areas of New Jersey. He started his own business, Reliance Medical Group, in 1989/1990. His business continued to expand to include 60 OB/GYNs across New Jersey, and then eventually into a multi-specialty primary care group, serving pediatrics, OB/GYN, and adult medicine. Although he no longer owns Reliance Medical Group, he continues to serve as a consultant physician and is a committee member for implementing medical clinics into Walgreens.
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